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Both Sides of the Fence

A Tosa resident since 1991, Christine walks the dog, cooks but avoids housework, writes and reads, and enjoys the company of friends and strangers. Her job takes her around the state, learning about people's health. A Quaker (no, they don't wear blue hats or sell oatmeal or motor oil), she has been known to stand on both sides of the political and philosophic fence at the same time, which is very uncomfortable when you think about it. She writes about pretty much whatever stops in to visit her busy mind at the moment. One reader described her as "incredibly opinionated but not judgmental." That sounds like a good thing to strive for!

Schooling Amanda: who decides?

Kurowski/Voydatch, Cal Thomas, kids, schools, politics



I'm feeling a little sorry for Wauwatosa school superintendent Phil Ertl. In deciding to forbid real-time viewing of a presidential speech, he's opened the door further for groups of parents with special interests to approve or censor curricula. And that can be a real headache.

Imagine trying to get consensus about anything except, maybe, math. Not enough of us understand that well enough to have political opinions about which math facts are dangerous.

Who should determine what's the right educational content for kids? What's the proper political stance for school? Who decides?  Parents or the government?

It's a trick question, because parents are the government. We elect officials democratically, including school boards, and in order to have a well-functioning society, we agree to go along with the rule of the majority and the law.

Which raises the question whether the employee Ertl or the elected school board should have made that decision. But I digress.

In a democracy, when we don't agree, we may object on conscience, vote the old bums out of office and put new ones in, protest, or civilly disobey. When it comes to schools, we talk to teachers and principals and boards. They may disagree with us, in which case we can become resigned, change schools, select private schools that we think reflect better our beliefs, or  homeschool.

In New Hampshire, the Live Free or Die state, the courts recently ruled that homeschooled Amanda Kurowski should go to public school for a while.

Her dad (divorced from her homeschooling mother) was worried that his daughter seemed to be developing somewhat extreme and very rigid religious beliefs--the same beliefs her mother holds.

You can understand the father's concern. By at least one account, Amanda thought that if her father really loved her, he'd believe as she did so he could be with her in heaven.

The idea "if you don't believe the way I do, you won't go to heaven" is very upsetting to kids. Especially when they love people with different beliefs. At that age, Ellen Dietrich baptized me in the school bathroom because she believed only those baptized as Catholics (I'd been baptized as a Lutheran) would go to heaven. And she loved me, so she wanted me to be saved.

Anyway, the court agreed with Amanda's guardian ad litem and her dad.  While Amanda is smart and healthy and basically well adjusted, it would be good to expose her to a broader range of religious ideas, it ruled.

I'm not sure why they think that's going to happen in the public schools, which aren't supposed to talk much about religion. My kids, who had liberal religious beliefs, experienced enormous pressure in Wauwatosa middle school to conform to conservative religious beliefs. That pressure came from kids, not teachers, of course.

I started writing this because I wanted to disagree with conservative columnist Cal Thomas. He wrote about the case as an example of elites (the court and, though it was quite a stretch, the Obama Administration) ruling against the people.

I saw it as a parental dispute in which the courts ruled with the conventional father against the sort of wacky mother, a common enough occurrence.

But my knee got stopped in mid jerk. After reading the brief, I found I agreed with those who think the decision was wrong. I don't agree with Amanda's mother, but there's really no evidence that Amanda's not doing pretty well, thank you, just as things are.

And I don't agree with Thomas's contorted politcization of the case. The issue isn't really about elites versus the people, homeschooling versus public schooling, liberals versus conservatives, secular humanists versus fundamentalist Christians, mom's rights versus dad's rights.

It's about everyone rushing to preserve and protect their personal views of reality. And forgetting Amanda in the process of making her a case and a cause.




 

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  1. I don't think you've been a teacher, Stubborn. Getting (and keeping) kids in a conversation is a very different thing from our interminable backs-and-forths here! I'd have been ecstatic if kids had wanted to have a serious discussion about. . . just about anything. What you imagine happening is so very far from what's likely to happen, not only in that but in the teachers' desire to indoctrinate--and the students' willingness to be indoctrinated.
  2. The GOP 'response' to President Obama's speech would likely be the exact same thing that President Obama spoke about. In other words, it would give all of the kids DOUBLE the amount of snooze time in class during those two speeches. I'm sure they'd all appreciate it.

    Like Tine and Beckkl suggest, there's no reason at all to politicize this particular speech that President Obama gave to the kids. That's precisely why I recommended showing the speech but prohibiting any classroom discussion about it afterwards. Otherwise, the 'discussion' could deviate into a 'discussion' about how those who object to President Obama's policies are only doing it because EVERY one of us is a racist. Isn't that exactly what former President Jimmy Carter said earlier today on television?
  3. I agree with Christine. This issue is not about schooling choice or religious ideals. It is not about the government trying to control either of those things. (which I don't think it should) It's about a child who had the misfortune to be born into a house run by "children" who can't get along. It is about deciding what is best for her because neither of her parents can get it right. That is sad.
  4. I'm with beckkl. Why on earth would you want to politicize this speech? An opposition response to a policy proposal is VERY appropriate, though I'd be happier if we realized there's not just either official party line: there's a whole spectrum of ideas. I think a lot of people are being oppositional just to be oppositional. Obama Defiance Disorder: they just say "no" without thinking.
  5. "I think the BEST thing to have done was to show Obama's speech and then immediately show the GOP response"

    And what would the content of this "response" be? Not trying hard in school?

    Eyeroll.
  6. I have a very similar experience compared to ChrisOmeally. Just like any kids in public grade school, I was making lots of new friends in Kindergarden and 1st grade. I remember that quite a few of my 'new' friends were being forced to walk to the Catholic school a few times a week for part of the morning. I was scared that my new friends did something wrong, and I couldn't figure out what it was. I thought they were being punished by the adults who were forcing them to leave the classroom.

    I grew up to be a rational, intelligent person, but my point is that at that young age, I, along with every one of my classmates was very impressionable since we really didn't know what was going on in the world aorund us. Our whole concept of the 'outside world' revolved around what was going on in that classroom (this was the days before soccer moms and soccer dads drove all their kids to tons of after school events). It's probably unreasonable to expect any teacher (private or public) to present both sides of any issue fairly and as a result, it's up to the parent(s) to indoctrinate their kids the way they want their kids to be indoctrinated.

    I agree. Ertl's in a no-win situation with regards his decision in the Obama speech 'controversy', just like every school administrator. I think the BEST thing to have done was to show Obama's speech and then immediately show the GOP response and DO NOT follow that by any teacher-led discussion of either speech. After the 2 speeches, the kids would do their math just like any other day. That would have made everybody happy, right? Well, OK, maybe "happy" isn't the right word, but at least that would tend to make them less angry. Can't we all just get along? Apparently not.
  7. This looks, to me, like a typical custody dispute in which Amanda is probably getting lost in the tug-of-war.

    Thomas chooses to focus on the struggle over her schooling while overlooking another disturbing aspect of the dispute. That is the mother's contention that Amanda is being harmed by contact with her father and her assertion that Amanda is not showing her true feelings when she appears to enjoy being with her father because she only reveals her feelings to her mother. I am guessing that this had as much to do with the recommendations from the GAL and the counselor as did Mom's religious beliefs.

    The brief that was linked indicates that Amanda's mother had previously requested modification of the custody agreement in order to limit Amanda's time with her father on grounds that he was causing her mental harm. She was seeing a counselor because of the mother's allegations against the father and not because of the dispute over her schooling. The fact that neither the GAL nor the counselor found evidence supporting Mom's allegations is significant. The conclusion that Amanda is doing just fine was related as much to her relationship with her father as it was to her schooling.

    Thomas has seized on this as an example of the courts interfering with personal freedom. I think it's an example of the courts intervening to insure that Amanda has the tools to make her own choices and that her mother is not the only influence in her life. It sounds like Dad was making an effort to support the homeschooling mission, so this matter may not have come before the court if Mom hadn't tried to limit Amanda's already limited contact with her father. That got the counselor and the GAL into the act, both of whom disagreed with Mom's approach.
  8. I also tried to convert my neighbor to Catholicism after being told in second grade CCD that non-Catholics were going to Hell. Not so much out of concern for her immortal soul but because I wanted someone to play with in Heaven. So I didn't even tell her about the Hell part - I appealed to her from a mercenary POV... "Hey, if you become Catholic, you can get your first communion next year and have a big party and lots of money and presents." "Mom, can I become Catholic?" "NO!"

    The funny thing is ... she's Catholic now. I'm not.
  9. Chris,
    Interesting post. And a very perplexing dilemma. Thanks for getting me thinking so early in the morning. There, I'm going to sneak out of here without really offering an opinion. But I enjoyed reading this!
  10. "It's about everyone rushing to preserve and protect their personal views of reality"

    .. and rushing to make sure that you can't have your personal view of reality if it differs with their own.

    It's not so much about winning these days as making sure the other side is losing.
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